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Naval Warfare

#1 User is offline   kingmaker 

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Posted 16 April 2006 - 01:17 PM

Something I'm always interested in but rarely find anything good about is medieval (especially late) naval warfare.

I wonder what you people can tell me about it, because I'm afraid to say I know relatively little about it, except that they often used boats (attempt at humour - do not be alarmed). I once managed to find a few good internet pages, which I put into my favourites, but lost them before I had a chance to read them properly (thanks to a virus).Can anybody recommend any books on naval warfare? Or just tell me about it?

I bet Liam Jieming can tell me what sort of weapons you'd find on a 15th century warship!

I hope somebody's read something good because I'd really like to know more...

This post has been edited by kingmaker: 16 April 2006 - 01:18 PM

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#2 User is offline   Liang Jieming 

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Posted 16 April 2006 - 07:53 PM

View Postkingmaker, on Apr 17 2006, 03:17 AM, said:

I bet Liam Jieming can tell me what sort of weapons you'd find on a 15th century warship!

Who's Liam Jieming?

:)
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Posted 17 April 2006 - 09:32 AM

View PostLiang Jieming, on Apr 17 2006, 01:53 AM, said:

Who's Liam Jieming?

;)



:) :) :blush:


sorry... Liang Jieming
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Posted 17 April 2006 - 01:29 PM

This is an okay article on how naval warfare evolved during the later medieval era.
http://militaryhistory.about.com/cs/navalw...avalwarfare.htm

This is an article that features a bit about Viking Naval Warfare: http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/ancient/vikin...eapons_01.shtml

Quote

Actual sea-battles were rare, and even then were fought close to shore. Ships were roped together in lines to face an enemy fleet and showers of arrows and missiles would have been exchanged. Each side then resorted to hand-to-hand fighting as they attempted to board their opponents' ships. The warriors in the prow were specially selected for this task. The aim was not to destroy enemy craft, but to capture them if possible, as they represented a considerable investment in time, resources and labour.

That's about all it says.

And this last article gives a very brief overview of Medieval Warfare.
http://medieval-castles.org/index.php/naval_warfare

This has turned out to be a tricky subject to research, unfortunately, this is the best I could find. Hope this helped. Cheers.

This post has been edited by Scèalaì: 17 April 2006 - 01:54 PM

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#5 User is offline   Liang Jieming 

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Posted 17 April 2006 - 08:25 PM

Limited to just the Medieval period?

Ok, two interesting stories to share.

***********
Since A.D. 1268, having frustratingly besieged the stubborn Song-held twin cities of Fancheng and Xiangyang for four long and arduous years two Persian Engineers were brought in to break the deadlock. By building their new hinged counterweight catapults, the Mongols now had the means to defeat the Song. In an epic artillery struggle that ensued between the two bitter foes, each side pummeled the other with bombs, boulders and all manner of projectiles. With time running out, the Song Emperor ordered that an attempt be made to rescue the besieged garrisons. A relief force of a hundred Song paddlewheel warships led by Generals Zhang Shun and Zhang Gui, ran the deadly gauntlet of Mongol catapults to try and break the siege. These highly maneuverable ships, formed into a rectangular formation were armed with traction catapults, firelances, crossbows and bombs. With red signal lanterns and under cover of darkness, they broke through the Mongol artillery barrage to deliver their supplies. However, the effectiveness of the new Mongol weapon inflicted a heavy toll on the Song navy, sinking ships and killing many onboard the surviving ships, including the two bold Generals in charge of this naval fleet. Despite the supplies brought in at such great a cost, the rescue proved too little, too late. Unable to adapt their own catapults quickly enough, the twin cities fell after a prolonged bombardment of Fancheng in A.D. 1273. The Song dynasty crumbled a mere six years later.
***************

In A.D. 1360-1363, three major combatants for the control of China in the wake of crumbling Mongol Yuan power, the Han, the Wu and the Ming, were in full conflict. At the siege of Nanchang just prior to the famous naval battle of Boyang Lake, the Han under Chen Yuliang had besieged the Ming garrison there. Cannons and catapults must have been present because, firing from their ships from the water's edge, the first Han assault opened a gap of over thirty chang in the city wall which was only refortified by the defenders with a new palisade of wood and earth after very intense fighting between the two combatants. Bogged down at Nanchang and eventually trapped on Boyang Lake, where the smaller and more nimble Ming ships were able to take advantage of the shallower depths as well as maneuver into upwind positions for their fire catapults and cannons, the Han naval might was soon smashed and its remnants incorporated into the Ming armies. This battle was one where fire catapults and cannons were used side-by-side in battle for the very first time in naval history. This round of intensive fighting was eventually whittled down to one sole winner, giving rise to the next dynasty, the Ming.

This post has been edited by Liang Jieming: 17 April 2006 - 08:26 PM

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Posted 18 April 2006 - 01:33 PM

That is brilliant!
"I could not be a traitor to Edward, for I was never his subject." -William Wallace
". . . for, as long as but a hundred of us remain alive, never will we on any conditions be brought under English rule. It is in truth not for glory, nor riches, nor honours that we are fighting, but for freedom -- for that alone, which no honest man gives up but with life itself." -- Declaration of Arbroath
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#7 User is offline   Liang Jieming 

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Posted 18 April 2006 - 08:30 PM

I have fuller accounts of these battles if you like, as well as a few more from the same periods. Boyang lake especially, is a fascinating read. The Ming ships were smaller and less powerful, and lost most of the battles with the Han 3-deck ships, but the Ming won in the end by having a better strategic plan.
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Posted 19 April 2006 - 07:15 AM

Quote

I have fuller accounts of these battles if you like


Where? I'd love to read them.
"I could not be a traitor to Edward, for I was never his subject." -William Wallace
". . . for, as long as but a hundred of us remain alive, never will we on any conditions be brought under English rule. It is in truth not for glory, nor riches, nor honours that we are fighting, but for freedom -- for that alone, which no honest man gives up but with life itself." -- Declaration of Arbroath
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Posted 19 April 2006 - 01:39 PM

yeah :sly:
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Posted 19 April 2006 - 08:28 PM

:sly: Ok. This is a translation of a chinese account by snowybeagle from CHF. Map from www.unitedcn.com but pinyin translations added by snowybeagle.

It's really long (but it's a long battle so what can I say.). :)

This was at the time of the breakdown of Mongol rule. The two major combatants were the Ming and the Han, led by Zhu Yuanzhang and Chen Youliang respectively.

Ming - (Red on the Map) Zhu Yuanzhang
Han - (Blue on the Map) Chen Youliang

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Battle of Lake PóYáng (鄱阳湖之战) - 7th month of AD 1363

This was the battle which ended Chén YŏuLiàng (陈友谅) as a major contender for supremacy in China during the anti-Yuan Dynasty (元) uprisings. It was considered a significant event in Chinese military history, with unprecedented scale in terms of personnel and number of vessels involved.

A pre-battle analysis of the forces of the opponents involved showed Chén YŏuLiàng having overwhelming numerical advantage against Zhū YuánZhāng (朱元璋).

Chén's troops claimed to be 600,000 strong against Zhū's 200,000.
Chén's warships were newly built, large and powerful. Zhū's were a motley assortment of mostly smaller boats and vessels rummaged from various places.
Chén's forces were well-supplied in terms of equipment and provisions.

Nonetheless, the crushing defeat of Chén YŏuLiàng highlighted once again that in warfare, the battle goes not always to the many.


Prologue

In the 2nd month of AD 1363, the warlord Zhāng ShìChéng (张士诚) whose turf extended from XúZhōu (徐州) in the north to ShàoXīng (绍兴) in the south, despatched his subordinate general Lü Zhēn (吕珍) to launch an attack on the last bastion of Little Ming King (小明王) at ĀnFēng (安丰). ĀnFēng was cut off from supplies and reinforcements, and its major general Liú FúTōng (刘福通) was killed in battle.

As Little Ming King was the nominal overlord of Zhū YuánZhāng, the latter received urgent requests for relief. Zhū YuánZhāng decided to go to the rescue as ĀnFēng's fall would expose his main base in YìngTiān (应天), and crossed the Long River in the 3rd month. He battled against Lü Zhēn and won three successive battles, causing the latter to flee.

Zhū YuánZhāng's departure with the bulk of his forces from JiāngNán (江南) gave what Chén YŏuLiàng thought would be a great opportunity to recover the territories of JiāngXī which Chén lost earlier to Zhū YuánZhāng at the battle of JiāngZhōu.

In the 4th month, Chén personally led his forces (claiming to be 600,000 strong) by water and land routes to attack the city of HóngDū (洪都). HóngDū was situated on the lower reaches of the Gàn river, along the plains of the northern banks. It was connected to the Long River via Lake PóYáng to the north. It was considered as a militarily strategic place.

For this battle, Chén had ordered the constructions of several hundred huge warships, painted bright red on the exterior, each vessel several zhàng (丈, 10 feet) in height. The triple decked warships had thoroughways for horses, and equipped with armoured hulls and scores of sculling oars. The largest of these ships could accomodate 3,000 people each, and the smaller ones 1,000.


Attack on HóngDū

Upon arrival, Chén's forces disembarked an launched aggresive attacks against HóngDū.

HóngDū was stoutly defended by Commander Zhū WénZhēng (都督朱文正) and staff officer Dèng Yù (参政邓愈), drill instructor Xuē Xiăn (指挥薛显) and the marshals Zhào DéShèng (元帅赵德胜) and Niú HăiLóng (元帅牛海龙). Zhào DéShèng and Niú HăiLóng perished protecting the city, and Zhū YuánZhāng's forces suffered heavy casualties. Nonetheless, the city held and was besieged for months, being cut off from the outside. In the 6th month, Zhū WénZhēng managed to get news to Zhū YuánZhāng through the subordinate Zhāng ZĭMíng (千户张子明).

When Zhū YuánZhāng who had returned to YìngTiān received the news of Chén YŏuLiàng's attack, the bulk of his forces were still away campaigning in Lúzhōu (庐州). Zhū YuánZhāng also got information that the water-level in the lake was falling, which eroded the advantages enjoyed by Chén YŏuLiàng's gigantic warships, and together with reports of Chén's forces experiencing mounting supply shortages and rising casualties, concluded it was a great opportunity to wipe out this rival.

Zhū immediately despatched orders to his generals who were commanding the bulk of his forces elsewhere. The Right Premier Xú Dá (右丞徐达) and Vice Premier Cháng YùChūn (参知政事常遇春), who were besieging Lúzhōu, were instructed to return with their armies. Meanwhile, he also sent messages to HóngDū to encourage them to hold on a little longer to wear out the enemy and buy time.

On the 6th day of the 7th month, Zhū YuánZhāng personally led Camp Commandant Féng GuóShēng (帐前亲军指挥使冯国胜), the military administrators Liào YŏngZhōng and Yú TōngHăi (同知枢密院事廖永忠, 俞通海), assembling a 200,000 strong force and set out to HóngDū's rescue.

On 16th/17th day of the 7th month, Zhū YuánZhāng arrived at HúKŏu (湖口) and methodically set about to trap Chén YŏuLiàng's forces within the lake and cut off his retreat:
(1) Commander Dài Dé (指挥戴德) stationed at JīngJiāngKŏu (泾江口),
(2) Another unit stationed at NánHúZuĭ (南湖嘴)
(3) Transferred soldiers from XìnZhōu (信州) to secure the river crossing at WŭYángDù (武阳渡).
Zhū then proceeded to lead his waterborne forces to enter the Lake PóYáng from SōngMén (松门).

On the 19th, Chén YŏuLiàng who had been unsuccessfully attacking HóngDū for 85 days and the morale of his forces were low. Upon learning of Zhū YuánZhāng's arrival, he lifted the siege of HóngDū and led his forces east into the Lake PóYáng for a showdown.

On the 21st, both forces faced off each other in the waters of Mount KāngLáng (康郎山水域).
Chén's warships were positioned upstream and adopted an imposing link formation stretching for tens of miles, .
Zhū YuánZhāng observed the linking of the enemy warships and concluded their mobility would be severely hampered. He told his men that the enemy would be out for a fierce fight after a long and futile siege, and said the day's battle would be crucial.
According to chapter 217 of 《续资治通鉴》, Zhū's forces were deployed into 11 units (some accounts 20), each unit equipped with large and small cannons, handguns, rocket-powered arrows, shrapnel-grenades, fire lances, multiple bolt launcher and crossbows (每队配备大小火炮、火铳、火箭、火蒺藜、大小火枪、神机箭和弓弩等)*. The units were ordered to get close to the enemy warships, and used the gunpowder weaponry first, then the crossbows, before finally engaging in melee battle.

Both sides engaged in a battle which was fierce and bloody. Xú Dá, Cháng YùChūn and Liào YŏngZhōng led the charge by Zhū YuánZhāng's forces. There were torrents of missiles, thunderous booms from the explosives, fiery blazes seen within 50 miles, which saw the waters of the lake bloodied red from burnt or drowned casualties numbering between ten to twenty thousand.

Xú Dá personally led the charge which routed Chén's vanguards, killing 1,500 opponents, capturing one of Chén's gigantic warship, boosting the morale on Zhū YuánZhāng's side. Shortly afterwards, Yú TōngHăi with favourable winds behind him launched cannon attacks which destroyed more than 20 enemy warships. Chén suffered numerous casualties killed or drowned.

Zhū YuánZhāng's side also took on heavy losses. Xú Dá's ship caught fire and Zhū YuánZhāng came to the rescue in the nick of time to chase off Chén's attacks. Chén's valiant general Zhāng DìngBiān tried to turn the tide by leadìng a ferocious attack on Zhū YuánZhāng's command ship, which hit shoals while retreating. Only the sacrificial fightings of Zhū YuánZhāng's loyal henchmen, includìng commandant Hán Chéng, Marshal Sòng Guì and Chén Zhàoxiān who perished, kept Zhū YuánZhāng from being harmed.

In the heat of battle, Cháng YùChūn shot Zhāng DìngBiān while Yú TōngHăi and Liào YŏngZhōng arrived on small boats to the rescue. Zhāng DìngBiān withdrew after seeing it was difficult to get near Zhū YuánZhāng. Liào YŏngZhōng pursued the retreating Zhāng DìngBiān, and hit him with another arrow.

By evening, both sides disengaged with heavy casualties respectively in a draw. Fearing Zhāng ShìChéng would attack from his rear, Zhū YuánZhāng ordered Xú Dá to return to guard YìngTiān.

On the 22nd, Zhū YuánZhāng personally commanded the formations of his troops and led the water-borne forces out to battle. Chén YŏuLiàng's monstrous warships came out in a tight formation and thwarted three direct attacks by Zhū's smaller vessels.

When his right wing was forced to retreat, Zhū YuánZhāng ordered executions of more than 10 officers to no avail. His subordinate Guō Xīng (郭兴) intervened and pointed it was not due to lack of effort on the part of his soldiers but the disparity of sizes between the opposing vessels. Guō Xīng suggested using fire, which Zhū adopted. He ordered 7 ships as decoys, to be loaded with explosives, mounted with strawmen dressed in armour and made to carry weapons. Brave volunteers steered these ships in a sneak attack.

In the evening, a northeastern wind blew across the lake's surface, providing them with a good opportunity. When the decoys neared Chén's warships, they were set ablazed, and aided by prevailing winds, soon set Chén's fleet on fire. The conflagration of hundreds of giant warships transformed the waters into a lake of inferno. More than half of Chén's troops were burnt alive, including Chén's younger brother and valiant general Chén YŏuRén (陈友仁) and Chén YŏuGuì (陈友贵), as well as his doughty commander Chén PŭLüè (陈普略).

Zhū's forces seized the chance to launch another attack and killed over 2,000 enemies.

The day ended in favour of Zhū, though he lost five generals that day.

The fighting resumed the following day on the 23rd. Chén YŏuLiàng concentrated the attacks against Zhū YuánZhāng's flagship. Unable to withstand the intensity of the onslaught, Zhū YuangZhāng exchanged clothes with Hán Chéng to escape.

Hán Chéng plunged into the water while being witnessed by Chén YŏuLiàng's forces. Thinking Zhū YuánZhāng dead, Chén relaxed his attacks slightly. That gave Zhū YuánZhāng a chance to board another boat. As soon as Zhū was away, his original flagship caught fire from cannon shots and was destroyed.

Aware that Chén identified his flagship by its white mast (or boom), Zhū ordered all his ships to paint their masts/booms white.

The turning point of the battle came on the 24th day. Chén's large warships encountered difficulty in maneouvering due to its complex operating mechanisms. Zhū YuánZhāng deployed Yú TōngHăi, Liào YŏngZhōng, Zhāng XīngZŭ (张兴祖) and Zhào Yōng (赵庸) to lead 6 fast ships to attack. The fast ships were able to dart in and out at will between Chén's warships, causing much damage, but more importantly, boosted the morale of Zhū YuánZhāng's forces. Zhū launched a general attack which smashed Chén's troops in a battle that lasted from early morning to the noon.

Unable to withstand the onslaught, Chén's forces retreated, leaving behind much weaponry, signal drums and flags floating on the lake's surface.

Chén tried to retreat to XiéShān (鞋山), but as Zhū already stationed troops to block off the route, he had withdraw to form a defensive line.

That evening, Zhū followed on his victory to block the escape route via ZuŏLí (左蠡), controlling the upper reaches of the River. Chén had to withdraw to the breakwater jetty of ZhūJī (诸矶).

For the next 3 days, the situation deteriorated for Chén YŏuLiàng who continued to suffer repeated defeats.
His Right Golden General (右金吾将军) proposed that since it was impossible to sail out from the lake, they should disembark their forces from the vessels and withdraw overland to HúNán (湖南) and stage a comeback (“出湖难,宜焚舟登陆,直趋湖南图再举。”).

His Left Golden General (左金吾将军) cautioned against it, pointing out that it was exposing their weakness and they could lose everything when the enemy dispatched light cavalry after them. (“此示弱也,彼以步骑蹑我,进退失所据,大事去矣。”)

Chén was undecided for sometime before agreeing with the Right Golden General. Seeing his advice unheeded, the Left Golden General surrendered with his units to Zhū YuánZhāng. Upon learning of the matter, the Right Golden General also surrendered as well. Chen’s forces were even more demoralized as a result.

Zhū YuánZhāng sent messages calling for Chén to capitulate. Chén reacted angrily by ordering all the captives he took massacred. Zhū did the opposite, releasing his captives, providing medical care to the wounded and funerals for those killed. This contrast created further dissessions within Chen’s ranks while boosting Zhū’s standing.

Anticipating that Chén would have to attempt a breakout towards the Long River soon, Zhū transferred his troops to HuKou, erected wooden barriers on both banks of the river and positioned fire-rafts in the middle of the lake. At the same time, he dispatched forces to take QíZhōu (蕲州) and XīngGuó (兴国), giving him control over the upper reaches of the Long River. After a more than a month of fighting, the Chen’s army’s supply route and retreat route were cut-off.

On the 26th day of the 8th month, Chén led his starving and worn-out troops in more than a hundred ships to attempt a break-out through NánHúZuĭ to enter the Long River and make for WŭChāng (武昌).

Arriving at HúKŏu, they were beset by Zhū’s forces who attacked them with fire-rafts and other warships. Thwarted, Chen’s forces tried to escape through JīngJiāngKŏu, only to be ambushed by Zhū’s forces from all directions.

Chén YŏuLiàng was killed by an arrow-shot, his army collapsed totally. His subordinate Chén RóngYú (平章陈荣于) led more than 50,000 trooops to surrender to Zhū YuánZhāng. Chén YŏuLiàng's heir, Chén Shàn’Ér (陈善儿) was executed, his second son Chén Lĭ (理), due to valiant efforts from Marshal Zhāng DìngBiān (太尉张定边), managed to escape back to WŭChāng.

Chén YŏuLiàng’s extravagance had amassed vast quantities of valuables such as gold-plated beds. Seeing the hoard, Zhū YuánZhāng compared Chén YŏuLiàng to Mèng Chăng (孟昶), the last ruler of Later Shu (后蜀) from the Five Dynasties and Ten Kingdoms era, who commissioned a urinal made of precious materials. Zhū ordered the extravagant items destroyed.

In the 2nd month of the following year, Chén Lĭ capitulated to Zhū YuánZhāng, who gained all the territories formerly controlled by Chén YŏuLiàng.

The scale of Battle of PoYang Lake was unprecendented in Chinese maritime naval history - with Chén YŏuLiàng claiming to have 600,000 troops against Zhū YuánZhāng's 200,000. The actual battle lasted some 37 days from the time 20th day of the 7th month to 26th day of the 8th month.

Chén YŏuLiàng, despite his superiority in number of troops, and sizes and numbers of warships, made a strategic error which led to his defeat. Instead of taking the chance to sail downstream to attack the unguarded base of Zhū YuánZhāng in YìngTiān (Nanjing) while leaving a smaller force which would have been adequate to tie down HóngDū, he focussed on the small but stoutly fortified and defended city, cramping his forces in a confined region where their advantage could not be brought into play.

Furthermore, Chén YŏuLiàng failed to despatch his troops to secure the various avenues of approaches and retreats to the theatre - the opportunity was seized by Zhū YuánZhāng who despite having fewer troops, wisely deployed them to secure these routes, a move which would prove crucial to the outcome of the battle.

Zhū YuánZhāng also perceived that Chén YŏuLiàng's forces, despite their numbers, were not united in purpose, with various factions rivalling against each other. Chén YŏuLiàng had not been able to achieve much gains despite heavy fighting in recent years while Zhū YuánZhāng's forces were high in morale.

Chén YŏuLiàng was also inflexible in conducting the war, while Zhū YuánZhāng was ready to learn from mistakes and adjust his methods accordingly. Thus, Zhū YuánZhāng was able to turn the disadvantage of his smaller ships into advantage, as well as seize upon favourable external elements such as the lowering of the waters of the lake which made it difficult for the gigantic enemy ships to manoeuvre.

This post has been edited by Liang Jieming: 19 April 2006 - 08:32 PM

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Posted 20 April 2006 - 09:47 PM

Here's another naval battle, this one fought in the open seas.

"In 1161, the Tangdao sea battle was fought on the Yellow sea between the Southern Song and Jurchen Jin dynasty. The Southern Song navy under Admiral Libao with 120 warships and 3000 men, destroyed the Jin's naval force which consisted of 600 warships and 70,000 men."

The numbers are a little suspect since this record was written by Song historians. I'm inclined to believe that while 120 Song ships is probably correct, 600 Jin ships is an exaggeration.
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#12 User is offline   Scèalaì 

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Posted 21 April 2006 - 07:26 AM

Thanks for all this info, it's fascinating!

This post has been edited by Scèalaì: 21 April 2006 - 07:26 AM

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Posted 02 May 2006 - 12:56 PM

Anybody got an idea how much it would have cost to build a ship in the 15th century?
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Posted 18 May 2006 - 06:09 PM

Here's a good source for medieval prices - and it looks like they're from the 14th cent. It doesn't list a ship, but we could try to use points of reference - a tower in a castle's curtain wall cost between 333-395 English pounds. The total armour worn by a knight was a little over 16 pounds (and that was supposed to be really expensive).

Under travel on this page it says that a barge cost 10 pounds. I'd guess about 12-15 pounds for a ship.
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Posted 11 August 2006 - 09:45 PM

Here's the last stand of the Song dynasty. After this naval battle, the Mongols (Yuan) finally gained total control over the whole of China.

(Excerpt from Yun's post on CHF)

*******************************
26 February 1279 - the Yuan general Zhang Hongfan (a former Song general who surrendered to the Yuan) leads an army to besiege the Song loyalists at the coast of Yashan. [Note: Yashan was a stretch of coastline, not an island]

6 March - Yuan general Li Heng arrives to reinforce Zhang Hongfan.

Zhang Shijie (Song Admiral) anchors the fleet and ties over a thousand large warships together with ropes, erecting towers like city ramparts on their decks, and placing the emperor Zhao Bing in the centre. When the Yuan fleet attacks, the Song fleet is immovable like a fortress. The Yuan then tries using fire-ships in a favourable wind to set fire to the Song fleet. Zhang Shijie has the Song ships coated with mud to fire-proof them, and then uses long wooden poles to push the fire-ships away before they can reach the fleet.

14 March - Song loyalist commander-in-chief Zhang Shijie's general Chen Bao surrenders to the Yuan army.

15 March - Song loyalist general Zhang Da makes a night attack on the Yuan camp, but is defeated with heavy losses.

19 March - A dark, heavy fog descends on the western part of Yashan. The Yuan general Li Heng takes advantage of the low tide in the morning to attack the northern (coastward) side of the Song naval encampment. Zhang Shijie resists desperately with Song troops from the Huai River region. In the afternoon, Zhang Hongfan leads a fleet to strike at the southern side of the Song encampment during high tide. The Song troops are exhausted and before long, one of the Song warships lowers its flag in surrender. Most of the other Song ships also lower their flags one by one. Zhang Shijie pulls his elite units back to the central encampment for a last defense, but the other units fall apart, with many generals surrendering.

By the time the Yuan troops reach the Song central encampment, night has fallen and a storm has broken out, with a thick fog obscuring everything. Zhang Shijie and Su Liuyi cut the ropes tying the ships together and escape from the blockade with more than ten ships. Song loyalist Prime Minister Lu Xiufu, seeing that Zhao Bing's ship is too large to escape and is tied securely to other ships anyway, takes Zhao Bing onto his back and jumps into the sea. Many other ministers and palace women jump into the sea as well.

25 March - Over 100,000 dead bodies are reported washed up on shore.
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#16 User is offline   Erik 

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Posted 04 April 2007 - 06:34 PM

There were some interesting developments in Tudor period naval action between England and France. The English had developed large big bellied Carracks with as many cannon as possible at gunports along the sides. The French brought galleries from their Mediterranean fleet to the northern seas. The galleys, propelled by banks of oars, were fast and manouverable and could spin on their own axis. They were equipped with one cannon, a Venetian Basilisk, mounted on the bow and aimed at water level. Rowing in the direction of the target vessel aimed the cannon and one shot at water level was enough to hole and sink the unwieldy enemy ship. Attacked by smaller vessels, the crewmen defended themselves With crossbows.





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#17 User is offline   Melisende 

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Posted 05 April 2007 - 02:51 AM

Eirk,

I am fairly certain that similar tactics were used in the fall of Constantinople (1453) where the Venetian galleys outmanouvred the Ottoman vessels which were larger and better equiped.

I believe that the Greeks (and their allies) used hit and run tactics as the galleys were much swifter.
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#18 User is offline   Saxon 

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Posted 05 April 2007 - 03:45 AM

The main problem with many guns used at sea in this period, is that they were one shot wonders.

England (and others) were developing cannons on small carriages while the Franch and Spanish (most notably in the Armada of 1588) favoured land guns that were not very manoverable. Their rate of fire was shots per day, while the smaller ship mounted guns of the English were looking at shots per hour. In the later naval period of the 1700s, a British man of war could often fire at twice the rate of other navies.

Galleys were also usually manned by slave or convicts and so had other problems as well.

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This post has been edited by Saxon: 05 April 2007 - 03:46 AM

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